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Was (is) Joe Boyd a slimey sleazebag?
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bmore



Joined: 14 Dec 2006
Posts: 632
Location: Suihua, Heilongjiang Province, China

PostPosted: Sat Jul 09, 2011 5:34 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Buy cheap; sell high. The first and last lesson of success.


If you're a trader.
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GJB



Joined: 18 May 2007
Posts: 39
Location: South of England

PostPosted: Sat Jul 09, 2011 7:43 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

You seem to think that everyone involved in the music business should survive on air and praise.
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LostBoy



Joined: 05 Aug 2007
Posts: 210
Location: Oxfordshire UK

PostPosted: Sat Jul 09, 2011 9:09 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

There are degrees.........and then there are degrees.
Praise usally comes at some sort of cost. Unless relations are involved of course.
It's said, and rightly so, those who can do and those who can't, teach. It also stands that those who can will and those who can't, exploit.
Except in the case of John Peel. As far as I know.
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JoeChrisMorris



Joined: 18 Jun 2007
Posts: 780
Location: New Jersey

PostPosted: Sat Jul 09, 2011 4:58 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

My dog has no nose.

How does he smell?

Awful!
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lostmusic



Joined: 15 Oct 2010
Posts: 32

PostPosted: Sat Jul 09, 2011 7:09 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I've read that John Martyn was physically abusive to his wife, Beverley and that he had some severe substance abuse problems. Could that possibly have contributed more to the irreparable damage to his marriage? Rolling Eyes
In "White Bicycles" it is clear there was no love lost between Joe Boyd and John Martyn and altho its not described exactly why, John Martyn was a difficult character.

Joe Boyd is a businessman and therefore interested in financial success but I never got the impression he wasn't sincerely interested in the music.
He made sure Nick's music would never go out of print before anyone knew there would be any money to be made from it.
(I told myself I wasn't going to participate in this discussion because its just discussion for discussion's sake. But here's my 2 cents anyway). Wink
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JoeChrisMorris



Joined: 18 Jun 2007
Posts: 780
Location: New Jersey

PostPosted: Sat Jul 09, 2011 7:46 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Joe didn't make any money for Witchseason, sold it to Island for a buck or something

Clearly if he was recording Nick Drake you was in it for the money as Nick only did a few gigs!

didn't tour or support his albums

Haven't read Beverley's recent book Sweet Honesty so I don't know how the relationship was between John and Joe
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LostBoy



Joined: 05 Aug 2007
Posts: 210
Location: Oxfordshire UK

PostPosted: Sat Jul 09, 2011 8:55 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I beg to differ on the "few gigs" we have been led to believe after reading this http://galacticramble.blogspot.com/2010/10/nick-drake-contemporary-press_19.html
posted in another thread. Of course, also there's always the unlisted and private ones everyone does that always get forgotten.
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lostmusic



Joined: 15 Oct 2010
Posts: 32

PostPosted: Sun Jul 10, 2011 2:44 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I haven't read Beverley Martyn's book either.
(By the way, whatever happened to the song she and Nick supposedly wrote together that she was going to perform back in October, 2010)?
In Joe Boyd's "White Bicycles" (pages 196, 199) it indicates he wasn't a big fan of John Martyn as a person. It seems the feeling was mutual.

And no matter how many live gigs Nick actually did, he still didn't make any real money for Witchseason or Joe Boyd.

Boyd's promotion of Nick before and after his death seems to be a labour of love rather than a rip off.

(two more cents) Smile
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Matt (admin)



Joined: 29 Jun 2006
Posts: 696
Location: United Kingdom

PostPosted: Mon Jul 11, 2011 9:05 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Narcissus wrote:
P.S. While I have your attention Matt (admin) - what did you think of Rilke's Letters to a Young Poet? And would you reccomend it to others?


I definitely would recommend it - it's a book to be read slowly and absorbed (and then re-read several times). Full of wisdom and truth
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JoeChrisMorris



Joined: 18 Jun 2007
Posts: 780
Location: New Jersey

PostPosted: Mon Jul 11, 2011 4:30 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

any talk about "Northern Sky"?
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Narcissus



Joined: 25 Jan 2011
Posts: 243
Location: United Kingdom

PostPosted: Tue Jul 12, 2011 6:47 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Please read the Beverley Martyn book Sweet Honesty. Although the writing is rushed and repetitive, it is very insightful, passionate, and ultimately, a rewarding read.

It does cast a dark shadow on John Martyn for he was a wife beating drunk. She explains how Joe Boyd tried to push her into a relationship with Nick Drake as a form of protection from John; as if it were “do you want the beauty or the beast?”

The book also explains how Boyd became silent during the Bev & John album Road to Ruin (by sitting in the sound room reading a newspaper) due to Beverley not seeing Joe’s advice through; to be with an abusive drunk rather than Nick was ineffable.

Matt (admin wrote:
I definitely would recommend it - it's a book to be read slowly and absorbed (and then re-read several times). Full of wisdom and truth


I am very pleased Matt!
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wayne



Joined: 20 Sep 2006
Posts: 481

PostPosted: Wed Jul 13, 2011 9:17 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

No. What Martyn said is interesting and may be similar to what Nick was getting at in Hanging on a Star.

But singers and musicians often complain they saw none of the money and their managers ripped them off etc. but I honestly believe Joe is 'one of the good guys'.

Without him we'd never have heard of the artists you've mentioned - let alone Nick.

In everything I've ever read on Nick, I've always got the impression Joe did the best for him and all his artists in a time when they were not prticularly fashionable and the wider music industry had no real interest.

It's probably a shame he left Witchseason to go to America (leaving Nick feeling abandoned) - but he did have his own life to live.
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JoeChrisMorris



Joined: 18 Jun 2007
Posts: 780
Location: New Jersey

PostPosted: Wed Jul 13, 2011 11:24 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

One assumes Joe went to the US for the money and that Witchseason wasn't doing so hot, financially


He certainly wasn't making a fortune off of Nick Drake!
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Narcissus



Joined: 25 Jan 2011
Posts: 243
Location: United Kingdom

PostPosted: Thu Jul 14, 2011 7:55 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

JoeChrisMorris wrote:
One assumes Joe went to the US for the money and that Witchseason wasn't doing so hot, financially


Perhaps Joe but I feel that he scampered to America because nobody needed him in the UK;

Nick was pushing what would become Pink Moon with John Wood.

The Incredible String Band became Scientoligists.

John Martyn was being John Martyn and felt Beverly was a lost cause.

Linda left Joe to become Linda Thompson to be (after a brief spell with Nick).

Yes Whitchseason was in debt, so it was a natural choice not a money grabbing ‘F@*k you all I smell dollar”
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Seran



Joined: 02 May 2010
Posts: 349
Location: Wirksworth

PostPosted: Fri Jul 15, 2011 7:26 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

There was an interesting television documentary on BBC4 the other night. It was about the Californian folk scene in the late 60s and early 70s and featured CSN&Y, Joni Mitchell, James Brown etc. It did cross my mind that if only Nick had moved there and signed up with Elliot Roberts and David Geffen - it really could have worked artistically. Of course, Nick would never have done it alone, but perhaps he could have followed Joe (who, by the way, I don't see as a shark).
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